Welcome arrakty

Admin Number of posts : 95 Registration date : 2008-11-06

How are you doing Arrakty?

I am truly sorry it has taken me so long to reply to your question but with all the changes happening and the Holiday Season, everything just went crazy for me and there was just not enough time. I always try and answer everyone but because I am the only one working on the websites now I have found myself running behind.

I do know everyone makes alot of commotion about taking benzodiazepines with Suboxone and Methadone. I believe if Doctors prescribe the two together they should monitor the patient carefully. If the patient is mature enough to handle them and he/she needs them I have no objection to it. In my opinion the quality of one's life is more important and if they really make it better for you then I believe they should be prescribed.

But I also believe the Doctor should take the time to explain to you the dangers involved once He prescribes them for you. Most of the Doctors I know doesn't do this and I'm not talking about just the interaction between the two drugs if you decide to increase your dose on your own or if you add alcohol to the mixture ...as you know it can be a deadly combination. It's not just the Subutex and Klonopin but what if you decide to buy some cold medication because you caught one. If you add an antihistamine and/or Nyquil to your medication it could be very dangerous. If you take very many medications, I would always have them filled at the same Pharmacy and if you decide to buy an over the counter drug then you can always ask the Pharmacist to pull up the medications you are taking and let you know if it is alright to take the products you are buying. I believe you are smart enough to understand the point I am making.

It's not all they should tell you. If you take Klonopin for a long period of time you will become addicted to it. I don't know if you are aware of this but if you decide to stop taking it and/or He stops prescribing it ---the withdrawal from benzodiazepines is the worst Hell in the world and please excuse my language but I know just how awful it can be. They never tell you this at all. I took Xanax with my Methadone for four years. I only took one at bedtime for sleep (0.5mg). Now I am a Pharmacist and I had no idea just how addictive Xanax was but the point was and still is it is the only medication that helped the pain in my back (neurological pain). My back would actually go into spasms. The MMT Facility I was attending decided they were not going to allow anyone to take benzodiazepines any longer with methadone. I was given no prior notice except if I tested positive for them they would cut my methadone dose in half (which showed their ignorance but they didn't care about me).

I tried to talk with them about it and I had many articles which advised you never to abruptly stop taking the medication and even the Doctor who was prescribing them tried to speak to him about it but the Medical Director at the MMT Facility wouldn't budge one inch. I knew by this time how addictive they were because I had began to build up a tolerance for them and my dose had been increased to 1mg at bedtime because of the withdrawal symptoms I began to experience. My body would just jerk and I knew it wasn't coming from the methadone because I had taken it too many years and never has such withdrawal symptoms. I left town for a few days to visit my parents and forgot to bring them and I actually had a sizure and it scared me -seriously I was so frightened.

Needless, to say I had to make a trip to the Ermergency Room and they did supply me enough until I returned Home. It was then I began to seriously reserch them more and I read about people trying to withdraw from them and I was actually shocked because how had I come this far and not known how serious and how much suffering I would go through to come off of them. I had no choice when they advised me I couldn't take them no longer even with the Doctor's prescription that I would have to transfer to another MMT Facility. It wasn't easy finding one but I did but it cost me much more money but I knew there was no way I could stop abruptly and I couldn't have my dose cut in half on my methadone and I picked up my Methadone monthly and he was going to make me come every day if I tested positive. (If I had been wealthy I would have definitely sued Him in court because what He did could have killed me if I had remained there.)

I believe when they start patients on them they should first talk to them about it and advise them of the medications you can't take with them and never to exceed your dose nor mix with them alcohol. If I was a Doctor I would put together a notebook with case histories of patients withdrawing from them and how they suffered from the patient's own account. I would also include all the withdrawal symptoms they may experience if they decide to stop taking them or if they stay on them for an extended period of time. I would let them know just how long it would take before they would feel normal again. I would give the notebook to the patient to read before I would prescribe them for Him/Her. When they returned to my office I would quiz them to confirm they had taken time to read it because I would want to know I had made all the dangers of the medication clear to them or else I don't think I could live with myself if I didn't do this because I would feel like it was my malpractice that was responsible for the patient's suffering if for some reason the patient had to stop taking them.

If they remained my patient then I would taper them off it gradually but it takes from 1-3 years depending on how much you were taking and how long. It still wouldn't be easy for them and working would be difficult but I tend to think what if the patient was transferred to another state, lost their job or I died. Then what would happen to them because they may not find another one who would prescribe it for them and certainly not if they could no longer pay for the medication. It happens all the time because I've worked in the medical field all my life and I have dealt with patients and heard their stories since I opened my first website in 2004. Many of them have actually committed suicide and this is why I would require the patient to know all of this before I gave them a prescription.

If they are aware of the consequences and they have a legitimate need for the medication then I have no problem with it. I went through agonizing withdrawal trying to stop using Xanax and I am still experiencing some of the effects from it but I need it for my back and I am trying to find a Doctor who will allow me to take it with my methadone. I believe this should answer your question.

I am going to include the information I have compiled on benzodiazepines on the new website I am building because I have discovered many people are not aware of it's addiction potential nor the suffering you have to experience to taper off of them. I think they need to have this information and because there are many deaths attributed to the mixture of methaodne and benzodizepines.

Now, were you aware of what I just told you? I would like to know if you did know all of it and were you planning on staying on the medication? How about an update on how you are doing? I like to know how each of you are doing and what is going on in your life? I hope you are still with us and I am hoping you like it here. I will be waiting to hear.

I'm trying to get the forum organized better so people will post in the correct places so if you have questions or need information, please answer my post there or under Suboxone. I'm hoping all is well and I have been up all night trying to get the posts in order and where they belong.

Wishing You the very best,

Deborah

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Sun 11 Jan 2009, 9:39 pm

Hi Arrakty, All I can say right now is hi and I'm real happy you are still around. I'm starting to hurt pretty bad right now and I've got a check-up appointment tomorrow. I'll write more to you when I'm feeling better. Honey, you take care and hang in there.
I'll write more when I'm feeling better.
Yours in the struggle, Barbara

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Tue 13 Jan 2009, 12:16 am

Hi all,
Just took the last of my family members to the airport, phew, that was a long hard 5 weeks of visitors!! Thankfully they all know that i'm in recovery but, even though I have explained my limitations and the fact that "If I don't put my recovery first, nothing else will work in my life" they still seem to ask way too much from me.
Being the only member of my family that has this disease can prove rather difficult at times. It's hard to say "sorry no I can't come out to dinner with you all cause I have a meeting" or " I really need some down time to do my step study".
I completely understand that because I look o.k (now) and act acceptably(now), I'm expected to be "over it"!!!!
I mentally hear them say......can't she just be normal now and put all that addiction stuff behind her.
Everyday, I think about what I have learned about life on this jouney, how much my disease has changed me for the better & No, I can never put this behind me because it is constantly teaching me to be a better human being.
I believe there are a lot of people out there who can share this testamony and be greatfull to be a recovering addict.
Thanks for allowing me to vent some!!!
Luv
Arrakty

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Tue 13 Jan 2009, 8:16 am

Hi Arrakty, I know what you mean about other people expecting you to be able to do things like you use to. I have one friend I go shopping with and not only does she walk fast, she has to go to every store in town. She knows a lot of people and she will stop to talk to them and go on and on. I enjoy her company and we are the best of friends, but I'm worn out by the time I return home.

I don't know if you heard, I had the surgery on my foot and recoverying real well. I got the bandage changed yesterday and the stitches come out next Monday. I'm hoping two more weeks and I can go back to work. I'm going stir crazy. I want to go out to my horses, but all I can do is call to them from my porch. I'm going to ask a neighbor friend to bring them up to me so I can cover my foot with a plastic bag so I can brush them. I love to smell them and feel their nose...so soft.

I'm in prayer you are doing well and life is being good to you. You've been with us for quite some time now. Let me know how you are doing otherwise...after you have caught your breath from your company.

You take care

Yours in the struggle,
Barbara Rue

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Tue 13 Jan 2009, 12:57 pm

Hi Arrakty,
It is good to see you. I don't have any of my immediate family near me, but I do have the in laws. They know of my addiction, I told them about it this last time going into treatment, they try to understand I know. But it is hard for them at the same time. They are from the day of thinking that if you have enough will power you can overcome addiction. Everyday I try to teach them something new, some of them get it and some don't.
I will tell you the same thing that I tell everyone else.
Education....... As hard as it is, all through our recovery we have got to educate those around us. Don't be afraid to let them know when you " need a meeting" it is alot better than needing to go get a pill. What would they rather have you do? Meeting? or Pill?
Now that the holidays are over, you can get yourself back to your routine. Maybe by the next time it is time for their visit, you will feel up to letting them know how you feel. Take advantage of the time you have away from them to mail them information on addiction and recovery. It will make for good reading. Also, you can send them the url's of both of our websites, they are a host of information. A bonus to our web sites are that they are Hon Code certified, in order for a web site to become Hon Code ceritfied every bit of information on it has to be proven and accurate. Deborah has worked very hard day and night to make sure that our web sites meet these requirements. I will include the url's at the bottom of this post for you. Just copy and paste it into an email. You can also go there if you need any information.
Anyway, it is good to have you back. We have a lot of new members since your last visit. Take your time to look around and get to know them. I'll be here if you need anything.
Yours,
Dee

Website url's

http://www.suboxoneassistedtreatment.org/

http://www.medicalassistedtreatment.org/

I just had a thought,
Your family is from out of town, am I right? We also have a url for a travel angency that your family can use. Part of the proceeds from this travel angency go directly to Medical Assisted Treatment therefore helping our websites stay open so that they can continue to help people searching for the information that they need. Isn't that great! The link to that website is below.
http://www.ytbtravel.com/matamerica

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Tue 13 Jan 2009, 1:36 pm

Hello Arrakty,
It's good to hear from you!! I've been wondering if you were doing okay?? I love you

The holidays are such a difficult time, as well as all of the excitement, you also have all of the stress!! I'm happy to hear that you know yourself well enough, & what you need for your own recovery, even if your family doesn't quite understand it yet. Your doing what you need to do & I agree with Dee, would they rather you take the time you need for a meeting or go get a pill instead?? I really do understand how our families have this perception though. As you said, NOW we act well!! My family is the same way. I think many people have the misperception, especially when people leave to go into an "inpatient treatment program" or rehab, that when that person comes back out, their families have the expectation that they are now just "healed!" As we all know, that's not the way it goes for most.. I watch that TV show called "Intervention" on Monday nights whenever I get the chance. Lately, I've been watching especially the part after the person has been in treatment for 2-3 months & what their perspective is now. Although, I worry for some of these people, as they believe that they are cured because they have had a few months sobriety at a nice beach side resort, away from all the stressers that they have to deal with in everyday life.. I wonder what happens when they go home & have to get back into the grind of daily life. Jobs, relatives, MONEY!! You know what I am saying.. Shocked

Sorry to go on about that Arrakty- train of thought!! Wink

I just wanted to let you know that I was very happy to hear from you & look forward to getting to know you better!! Way to go on sticking to what you need!! Exclamation

I know that is not an easy feat as a woman!! cyclops

Hope to talk to you more soon!
Many Blessings,
Beth I love you

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Wed 14 Jan 2009, 10:37 am

Thanks,
Thats great advise, I have worried over the years that by constantly throwing information in their face it will tire them of my issues and that in turn will push them away! My mum is my advocate, she's well read on the subject and willing to talk whenever I want to. The other family members see it as... I 'had' a problem and now I don't.....so whats the big deal attitude. Unfortunately they are the kind of people who I call "self serving", all caught up in their own lives and opinions and as long as I don't effect them in a negative way there's nothing wrong! I can't change that.
My mum is really my only concern, she has gone the distance with me and never given up.
Today is another good day, I feel optomistic and believe that opportunity is right here knocking at my door. so on that note i'll say bye and most importantly Make it a great day Very Happy

Lots of love Arrakty

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Wed 14 Jan 2009, 1:34 pm

Arrakty,
I must say, that it is good to have you back.
As long as you have your mom in your corner, there is still a chance that maybe someday the rest of your family will come to understand. But if they don't, that is their decision. I will do all that I can to make today a great day. The sun is shining, although it is still so cold, we do have the bright rays of sunshine. sunny

Check in later and let us know how your day went.
Yours,
Dee

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Wed 14 Jan 2009, 4:45 pm

Hi Arrakty! sunny

It was super to hear from you!! Aren't our Mothers the most incredible people?? Exclamation

I understand just where you are with your family, as mine seems to be the same way, but thank God for Mama! She's been in my corner & my biggest advocate, as well as a source of encouragement throughout this whole ordeal! It makes me proud to be able to look at my Mom & be telling her the truth when I say that I'm not "on anything" or haven't messed up everything in my life again!! She's full of support & understands my need for the Suboxone. I never thought that this would be possible, but here we are.. cheers

The relationships that have been strained throughout the years due to my use are starting to continually improve!! I really dreaded the extended family functions during the holidays, but was pleasantly surprised how they ended up turning out. I can even remember every place that we went!! Wink

Of course, its not like everything is all peaches & cream. Nothing is forgotten! I especially feel that from his mother, those "inlaws" seem to have such a misperception of me. I had a terrible time when we went there for Christmas, it actually makes me sad! Sad

My husband has one brother who's been divorced for around 9-10 years. He has two beautiful daughters that he's basically raising because his ex-wife is now living with a 20 yr old kid. She was also married in between the two, & had a son with that now-ex-husband. He has full custody of their son. Anyways, my point being, I'd really hoped that through marriage that I'd have a sister-in-law or at least, a relationship with his Mom.. but that's not the way that it's worked out!! I actually seem to have that kind of relationship with his Dad, which is particularly nice because my relationship with my own father has been strained for several years.. His father moved in with us a couple of summers back while recovering from triple bypass heart surgery & we'll probably live with him forever at this point. I enjoy having him here, as his health isn't great & he's lost both of his brothers this past year. It's just nice to know that he's okay & eating well, getting around okay.. Also, he just adores the kids!! They are what "light him up!!" Idea

He's a great man & I know where my hubby got it!! I love you

Okay, now that I've gone on & on, it's time for me to close this up & check out the rest of the posts. I hope that you are making a SUPER day Arrakty & thanks for the encouragement!! Look forward to talking with you soon! Wink

Yours,
Beth I love you

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Thu 15 Jan 2009, 10:48 am

Hi Sweets, do they really call you Arrakty? How about Arrie from Australia? I'm so glad you popped back in and I hope things start going differently for you. I know when I accept where I am and get comfortable with what I have, something happens for the better...sometimes something wonderful.

I have a friend over and is running scans and just giving my machine a general check up. She's also going to help me with some things on the forum so I can preform better. Stay on subect...stay on subject...stay on subject.

So, are your meds working for you? Do you have a hard time getting your medication down? Let me know.

I'm so glad you are sticking with us. You're a good egg.

Well, Crickette is wating for me to get off so she can do some work on line.

Please answer,
Yours in the downunda,
Barbara

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Thu 15 Jan 2009, 8:05 pm

Ok, if you must, Arra is fine!!!

Yes my meds are working really well, I'm coming up on 5 months, it went by sooo fast. I have to stop myself and really think about the things I don't think about anymore....make sense of that???? I used to dream of floating on a bed of oxy 80's that seems so bizare to me now. Actually that brings me to a question, Do any of you still dream? I used to have quite vivid dreams, now nothing, huh, The other question I have is a biggie! and i'm looking for responses from both genders.....How has bupe affected your intimacy ( I can ask that right? ) I know that when I was using I had little to no interest in sex along with no female cycle. now 5 months clean my body is getting itself back on track and i'm wondering if the bupe affects your libedo like narcotics.
PLEASE NOBODY BE OFFENDED AT MY QUESTIONS WE ARE AFTER ALL HUMAN & HAVE NATURAL DESIRES affraid

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Thu 15 Jan 2009, 11:37 pm

Arrakty,
No offense taken, and a good question if I might add.
In my case, if I take my full dose of 16mg a day, I have no sex drive. ( put it plain and simple) But if forget to take my dose or just take a low dose for the day, it is increased.
I am glad that you did ask that question as it is something that I have been thinking about.
There is no wrong question, so don't worry.
When I was taking opiates our love life was non exsistant. As for the female cycle, I am 50 years old so I am going through the change. Hot flashes and all.

I used to have the really vivid drug/using dreams. They would be so bad that I would wake up in a cold sweat, but after about 3 months I no longer had them.
One thing that I have noticed though, since I have been in recovery, even the thought of myself taking an opiate makes me severly nauseated.
I hope that this answers your question from my stand point.
You can ask any question that pertains to the Subs, recovery, etc.
I hope that your night is a good one.
It is late and I am tired so I will get off of this thing now and get myself into bed. Sleep

Sleep with the angels
Dee

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Fri 16 Jan 2009, 2:16 pm

Hi Arra!!

I got on here this morning & started reading these posts, actually had to stop & laugh when I read this one because I felt like I could've written it, except for the length of time being on them.. I had a very vivid dream last night (this morning?) & as I woke up, I almost felt like I was withdrawing for a few minutes until I got my Sub into my system. I don't normally wake up like that anymore. Yet, the dream was so very real feeling & I woke up feeling like I wanted OCs for a few minutes. Like I said, it went away just as quickly, but was strange to me now, where it was a "normal" feeling everyday while I was using!!

I'm so thankful to not normally feel like that anymore!! I was all sweaty & shaky hands, actually, just very shaky all over!! I felt nauseous & that just plain YUCKY feeling all over.. I'm so thankful to not feel that way any longer. I just can't say it enough.. I feel much better these days, as these type of feelings only pop up here & again, it continues to be less & less often!! Thank God!!
As for my libido, what libido?? Shocked

The Subs have definately affected this for me!! I also have no sex drive while taking these. My hubby & I talk about it though. He understands & we make do, remaining close just by "cuddling" most nights. As its hard for us to get "alone" time anyways with having these two young babies, as well as a teenager who seems to have a 6th sense that we may be getting "too close" & comes arunning!! Wink

But, yes, the Subs have DEFINATELY changed my sex drive all around!! Crazy as it sounds though, even though our sex life is affected, our relationship is closer than ever!! Idea

Hope things are continuing to go well for you!!
Look forward to hearing from you soon!! Wink

Your Friend,
Beth I love you

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Sat 17 Jan 2009, 9:01 pm

Arra,
I say go for it, girl. These feelings come back to me right when I got over being mad cause I couldn't have some dope. Then when I knew I wasn't going to have any, then I wanted something else. If I have to give up something, I have to replace it with something positive and I'm positive I have special needs...even just to cuddle or hug and hold hands.

You are starting to make a difference in my life.

Sorry I haven't been here lately, I've been having my machine worked on for three days. You know what they say, "A clean house is the sign of a broken computer!" lol

I'm here if you want me,

Yours in the struggle,
Barbara, moderator, mentor

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Sat 17 Jan 2009, 11:08 pm

Hi all & thanks for all the response Very Happy

good to know it's not just me experiencing these issues. I still wonder wether there are some men on the forum that could give me their take on the subject!!!

My resolution for this year is to cut down on the subutex, i've managed so far to get to 16mgs a day from 32mgs over the past 5 months. I hope to be at 8 by summer if I can keep my pain threashold stable. I still can't believe that I have come this far, I really didn't think that I could do it, every day I get more and more clarity back in my life, I look in the mirror and see myself getting younger not older.... the black circles under my eyes are vanishing and i've gone from 85lbs to 110. Talk about a miracle, I'm living one.
Just a few months back my living hell was waking up everyday and wondering why I was still here. Now I know why i'm here so...... bring it on!!!!
Love n Peace
Arra x

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Sun 18 Jan 2009, 10:52 am

Hi Arra!
How are you doing? It sounds as though you are completely full of strength & ready for the world!! I love it girl!

I'm very happy for you as I'm reading your above post & hearing how much better your life is getting!! I remember that feeling that you referred to about waking up in a living hell everyday! Twisted Evil

I hated myself & hated what I was doing, but had no idea how to get out of that cycle.. I'd tried to quit a million times before, managing to fail worse & worse each time. I'd truly given up hope that there was any chance of recovery in my future..

Thank God that I was wrong, once again! Wink

As I look back today, I still question myself & wonder how I could've possibly done some of the things that I did. Crying or Very sad

Those are horrifying memories for me, but great motivation to continue on with the Subs, as my whole life has changed since starting them! It sounds like yours has changed as well. You must be a tiny little thing if you were 85lbs & have only gone to 110lbs.. I considered myself on the smaller side, but weigh 118 lbs, yet like you, I've gained 10 of those pounds within the last 9 months since I've stopped using. I credit it to taking better care of myself. Idea

I eat better, even if I'm not hungry, I make sure to "fuel" my body. I love how you said that your starting to look younger rather than older, with those black circles vanishing from beneath our eyes, I love it girl!

Good for you! Please keep letting me hear about these changes that are occuring for you, as its such a great reminder for me, so very inspiring! I'm very happy for you Arra, that your life is continually improving for you everyday!! Sending hugs & blessings your way! I love you

Talk to you soon! Wink

Your Friend,
Beth I love you

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Sun 18 Jan 2009, 11:28 am

Hi Arra,

I've just gotten up, so I don't know how intelligent I'll be in this state. I just wanted to say hi and ask to hear from you. My girlfriend has been here for three days customizing my machine, so I couldn't send or read any of my mail. I'm 118 meassages behind. Awwwww!

So, I'll see you in the Sunday funnies maybe?

Love to you,
Barbara

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Wed 21 Jan 2009, 11:00 pm

Hi Arra,

I was only kidding about the Sunday funnies. I'd like to hear from you soon. I know it's hard on you right now. I understand if we don't hear from you often. I miss you!

yours in spirit,
Barbara

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Thu 22 Jan 2009, 8:09 am

No worries Barbara,
I just have been busting my ass for the past few days! Take the work while it's there approach. Not to good for my RA, but needs must. The strange thing is that because i've been so involved, I have for gotten for the past three days to take my full 16mgs, I take 8 around 6am then 4 @ 2ish & 4 before bed. Forgot the 2 dose so have been fine on 12mg.......Yipee. I wasn't planning on dropping the 4 until April, so we'll see how I go, I don't want to get 'behind the bus' with the meds, but am pleased with myself all the same.
I hope you are healing well from your surgery, you are in my pray's
Off to work....My word it's fridgid out there!!!

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Thu 22 Jan 2009, 8:32 am

Good Morning Arrakty,
That's the way it is with Suboxone. It works so well that sometimes you are able to cut down on your dose with out even realizing it.
With most medications the more you can take the better. But with the Subs, more is less. And that is so true.
I'm glad to see that your able to go out and get the work done and that it is available to you right now, with the econnomy the way that it is, it's so hard for everyone out there.
I hope you have a good day. Were here if you need us.
Yours,
Dee

sunny

Subject: Re: Welcome arrakty Thu 22 Jan 2009, 3:42 pm

Hi Arra,

I'll bet you are good at what you do. To become involved with work and not think of yourself (meds.) is a good sign you put others before yourself. After all our meds are the center of our being right now. I'm down to 4 mgs a day; I could do 2, but not have any energy at all. I hate going through that again. I'm going to have to sooner or later cause I'm going to beat this thing. I won the war with alcohol. I'll have eighteen years this coming August without a drink. I have to always keep in mind, I'm still an alcoholic and can't have that cold beer on a hot sweaty day. There's a drug out you can have a drink and not go off on a binge, but I don't want another pill I have to take. I want to be as kind to my poor organs as I can. It's bad enough that I smoke.

Well, I was replying to ask how you are and I looked over my post...it's been I this and I that. I do care how you are doing and kudos to you on your meds. If you can, it would be good to keep a personal journal about how much you did and when and what triggered you to go back on your regular dose. Just a suggestion. I have to write things down or I forget and don't think of it again till I'm doing it again or forgot to do it. Whatever, I'm just glad you're hanging with us and you're here when you can. Shows dedication and resposibility. Good girl. Looks like you're going to win this round. I'm in prayer for you too. I love to see someone get somewhere in life and not wait until you're 65 like me. I know all things happen for a reason. I guess mine is to say, it's never too late. I almost didn't make it. I don't think I have another detox left in me. I've got to make it this time or give up.

I've got to go keep an eye out for the furrier to come do the horses hooves. One of them is getting over an abcess on his front foot.

Got to go,
Yours in spirit,
Barbara

» Arrakty, respond please